By Walter Broeckx
This was a difficult day to be an Arsenal supporter. Let me start by congratulating the away supporters. For a large part of the second half I heard them support the team. Even my match commentator said they out sung the home supporters at that time. Despite the difficult game they showed that they are true supporters.
In the darkest hours as a football supporter one can do two things. You could have a go at the whole team, the players, the manager, the board. Or you could say: ‘okay, such things happen in live. Being a football supporter is not always rosy and shiny. This is part of it.”
We could look at some maybe valid excuses. The penalty miss from Van Persie when it was 1-0. The missed chances after that. The unbelievable perfection of almost every shot and free kick from United that for some reason always ended in the top corner of our goal. We could look at the missed chances that could have brought us back to 3-2. We could point at the fatigue that entered the team after one hour when it showed we had been playing a difficult away game at Udinese on Wednesday evening.
But we know such a defeat is sometimes part of the game. Even more because…. well we have seen it before. And I don’t want to add to the pain but this wasn’t the first time Arsenal suffered a hard an heavy defeat at Old Trafford. We can only hope that just like the last time it happened we can avoid such thing for a few years now.
Because it was 10 years ago we suffered a similar thing. It was 25/02/2001. And we lost 6-1. Now we all could say that the players who were out on the pitch are worthless after such a defeat. We could say that we must get rid of them. But if we would have done this in2001 we would have lost a few legendary players. Because the starting line up in that game were:
Goalkeeper: David Seaman
Defenders: Oleg Luzhny, Ashley Cole, Gilles Grimandi, Igors Stepanovs
Midfielders: Robert Pires, Patrick Vieira, Ray Parlour, Silvinho
Strikers: Sylvain Wiltord, Thierry Henry
Seaman stayed another few years around and brought us another 2 FA cup victories.
Ashley Cole became a part of the invincible before turning in to the money grabbing person he still is.
Just look at our midfield…. Robert Pires was there. Ray Parlour was there. And most of all… Patrick Vieira was on the receiving end of this bad loss.
And we had Wiltord in our attack, who one year later took revenge by scoring the winner when we won the league at Old Trafford. And we had Thierry Henry in attack. The best goal scorer in our history.
The team that was out there in the field was actually the core of the invincibles. Also Ljunberg came in later in the game. Another future invincible.
The core of that team won us the double just one season later. Yes there were some changes in that team. Just as I think there will be some changes when all our players are back fit and not suspended. And I think that even when we play next time we will have some changes. As there always will be changes in a team. When some players are back we already have on our books we will be stronger. And if we can add a few names in the next days we will be stronger.
And if you look at the names I mentioned in the team that lost at Old Trafford in 2001 you see that this team contained half of the invincibles in fact. I spell their names out once again: Cole, Pires, Parlour, Wiltord, Vieira, Henry, Wiltord. That is 7 players who formed an integral part of the invincible. I really don’t know what the supporters said after the defeat at Old Trafford 10 years ago.
I can imagine them blaming Wenger, the players for not having what it takes. Well one season later they proved them all wrong. And a few years later when they were on their peak they brought us the invincible season.
Sometimes history repeats itself. As it did today with our defeat which brought us the painful memory back of that defeat 10 years ago. Well after that defeat we only became better. And had one of the best spells in our history even with going a whole season unbeaten.
So if you want to throw all and everyone away…just as could have happened 10 years ago.. we maybe would never have had a title each year and an invincible season.
So just like the away supporters who backed the team I will support the team. Yes it is painful. But nobody promised me that there would be no pain when supporting Arsenal. Nobody said that this will not happen to us. Defeat is part of life. And what is important is that we try to learn from our defeat.
Who knows maybe the defeat at Old Trafford 10 years ago was a blessing in disguise. Maybe the pain on that day inspired the core of the invincible to their greatness later on. So what looks terrible today might just be the start of a new bright tomorrow for our club and for many of the players that were on the field today. Sometimes shit happens. Sometimes you step in to the shit. It’s painful and embarrassing. But the only thing you can do is clean up your shoe and get on with life.
Come on you Gunners.
PS: Oh and I will be there for the next home game against Swansea. I will be travelling a few hundred miles just to show you that whatever happens I will be there to support you. Come good times, come bad times. Once a Gooner, always a Gooner. No defeat can kill my love for the Arsenal. It didn’t kill my love 10 years ago. And even now I am so glad I didn’t turn my back on you when things went against us.
Cahill and Hazard are on the way to Emirates. Finally.
My fellow Gooners, believe me when I tell you our season starts on Sep 1st.
Good on you Walter. That’s the spirit. It mirrors my own views we support Arsenal, they need our support now. The away supporters were fantastic. As for the game; defensively dreadful and shocking, despite the numbers out a better collective performance was required. Still it is done, we all have to live with it and move on.
Thanks Walter. Great article! Just what we need on a morning like this.
You’re having a laugh, I read in the comments.
Well, yes, at times I did.
I never actually expected a win, a draw would have been fantastic but still unexpected, in fact, nil points was always on the cards.
So why did I laugh? It wasn’t funny to see goals simply flying into the net – I wasn’t amused that our defensive line made no movement in between the ball being rolled from a free kick allowing Rooney (or was it Elton John?) time to place his shots – seeing RvP and Rambo so off form that they afforded no danger to the Mancs – it wasn’t in the slightest bit amusing to see that our two subbed scorers appeared too embarrassed to look AW in the face when they left the field.
So why did I laugh? It was better than crying. After 5 goals against, it didn’t matter. It was only 1 game. I’ve seen worse things happen to The Arsenal. And, mostly, I was already imagining all those doom and gloom comments – often made more credible by being written in CAPITALS.
Ignore them, you true fans, it could be worse. We could be bottom of the league.
And thanks Pete for the video of the Arsenal fans singing for twenty minutes after full time!
Sometimes things have to get worse before they get better. Yesterday has to be a wake up call for the whole club. The last thing Arsenal want now is to sack the manager like throwing the baby out with the bathwater. The squad is no longer in a position to go for all four trophies. There has to be a realisation and and adjustment in priorities. Wengers strengths do not include tactical nous..he needs help. The defence is shocking and lacks co ordination that a top quality defender and leader would instill. Wengers teams play the same way, if he has top players playing the system they are unbeatable. We no longer have that luxury..where is plan B?. What he is good at is unearthing good talent, developing and selling at a profit…great for Arsenal PLC as long as the fans stay faithful but gradually erodes the players identity with the club and the Arsenal spirit he so often alludes to. I saw very little of the Arsenal spirit yesterday.
It’s rather hard to sugarcoat this result, and you have done a good job of it Waletr. I still believe in Wenger, but we must all accept that something is horribly wrong with the way the club is managed. Is it the board, Silent Stan, the back room staff, Wenger? We need a major shift, and we have only 3 working days for it. Urgent action is required now.
The only silver lining: This could be a major wake up call to all at Arsenal and 3 days to attempt to fix things. This could have happened next week and we would have had no way to remedy.
I thought it an interesting parallel between last seasons 5-0 drubbing of Madrid, where Mourinho used a crushing defeat to the bitterest rival to ENHANCE his standing within the club. We could have gone to OT, played very negatively and still lost, albeit 1/2-0.
“The unbelievable perfection of almost every shot and free kick from United that for some reason always ended in the top corner of our goal.”
It’s strange no-one has mentioned this. I swear 5 of their goals were just amazing, and we could have scored at least 4. I’m not saying we would have won, but I think the timing of the goals, and the penalty miss were very important, and on another day, had we scored the pen or had djourou done better against wellbeck (as he really should have), we might have grown into the game and put in a decent performance.
We gave them too much space to shoot, but you can’t expect such brutal punishment over and over like that. I know ashley young is well capable of shooting like that but when will he next score one goal as perfect as either of his goals today, let alone 2! Rooney’s freekicks were ridiculous, and he isn’t usually deadly from set pieces – can’t remember him scoring one since his first CL game against fenerbahce (maybe he has scored one or two in 7 years, but he’s hardly prolific from fk situations).
I think merson is right that wenger does deserve some blame for not setting the side up better so that we could have put up more of a fight, and his “sending lambs to the slaughter” is a fair analogy to make here, but we have also suffered some ridiculous bad luck, not just today but over the course of the season. This time it was bad luck with our finishing, and very bad luck with theirs. Again, I’m not saying we could have won, just that we could very easily have done a bit better and avoided losing in such a horrendous manner. With the injuries and suspensions and recent sales, it always seemed unlikely we would get anything from this game.
thanx real supporters, i couldnt sleep last night but the real mad defeat compared to the situation provides perspective.
whats bugging me tho is its seems all self inflicted even the injuries to a point. i think ill reserve judgement till i see who we bring in and when we have the majority of the first team playing.
History did repeat and will not repeat. Ten years ago we were beaten 6-1, this time we were beaten 8-2. Different scoreline and different history to tell.
The difference between the team of 2001 and that we have got now is the 2001 team had high spirit and determination, and the lost was not expected and it was almost like an accident. The 2001 had leaders who eat and breath football. While the current team has got no determination, the morality is low and we expected to loose before the ball was kicked. Anyone who saw the lineup before the game knew that we have got no chance of coming home with even a draw.
We will support arsenal no matter what, but the truth must be said. Wenger needs to buy experience players.
Great post!
I needed to be reminded that some good can happen after a disaster.
I’m certain that our season starts after the transfer window closes. It was a certainty that Wenger would not buy players right after Cesc & nasri were out, but would wait until the last seconds of the window to pull down prices. it’s just how we operate, and I accept it.
But we should put this loss into proper context:
-We were missing our main defensive unit (Verm, Sagna, Gibbs, Song, Frimpong)
- Ball possession of both sides were nearly equal
- We managed to get roughly 80% of MU’s shots (both total and on-target) without a proper “creative-outlet” type of player. And those were quality chances.
- Rooney and Young were RIDICULOUSLY on-form. Young would probably only score 5 of those wicked curlers in his entire career (and unfortunately for us, 2 happened in one game). Rooney wouldn’t score from free kicks more than 4 times in a season (and unfortunately for us again, 2 happened in the one game against us)
- Remember than United usually had terrible starts to their season, but they showed “mental strength” (whatever the pundits call it) toward the end of the season. Why can’t we do it? Especially with our increase of “British mentality” in the first team.
Keep the faith Gooners! Our EPL season starts against Swansea.
Cheers, all the way from Indonesia
@Walter,
You really should let some fans vent their frustration because that is all some need to do to help them accept the reality express train that hit AFC yesterday. Some would accept no explanations as they cannot even think for themselves (its too much hard-work) and will go around parroting others.
We should now be talking of the process of finishing the AFC building, not re-building, process (this process has been on since 2004). AFC fans need to come to grips with that as a fact. Sacking AW now will abort that process and do irreparable damage to it. The AFC board appears to be very culpable in the debacle and I think Gadzidis has a lot of explaining to do on why new transfers are taking forever and the out-going ones are also taking forever.
When AW was asked during an interview what he planned to do to replace Nasri seeing he had been sold to one of the club’s main rivals (an official notification had not been posted as at that time) he responded “no one has told me that…” (Nasri has been sold)! AW was either being clever or had truly not been told that rank had been pulled on him to sell Nasri rather than allow him to go for free one year later as he (AW) wanted.
To me, if there are differences between what the Manager says publicly and what actually happens thereafter it could mean any of the following: the manager is lying and is being untruthful with the fans; or the board does not agree with the manager and therefore sold the player against his protestations. I would like to believe the 2nd option because Fabregas was also sold against the Manager’s expressed wish that he be sold at no less than a 40m pounds valuation.
Fabregas got sold off to Barca against AW’s wish at an unacceptable price. Even the said fee is to be made up from the player’s own future wages over a period of years. All that points to some mean ogre like approach by someone in the hierarchy who does not care about AFC fans, the players nor AW. I could imagine that/those person or persons rubbing their hands with glee and smacking their lips with relish at the prospect of the profits tumbling into the club’s coffers.
The image of AW that I see, in recent times, at the dug-out does not strike me as one who would take deliberate steps to destroy the work he has spent the better part of his career putting together. If you have been a project manager/founder you would appreciate the turmoil through which AW is going through right now. Some members of the board who are managing AFC today were not part of the team that co-founded project youth.
Their buy-in is therefore suspect and is probably based only on the income generation and the self-sustaining appeal it has. That there is an investing period when no reasonable revenues will be expected is anathema to them. This is why there is a schism between those who favour higher wages and those opposed but favour high figure transfers. What could AW do? He could either walk or live with it. It appears he has chosen to live with it (just like the mother who would rather have her child claimed by an impostor than have him dismembered by King Solomon – the King gave the child back to the mother).
AW is part and parcel of project youth; you cannot separate the two without doing serious harm to both of them. The other components were the stadium, delivered. The Highbury flats to pay for part of the expansion, delivered. Topping up of transfers to replace normal attrition and departures is the sticky point because Chelsea and now Manchester City, who were not part of the equation are now part of the picture. Manchester United responded well and has adjusted their wages structure accordingly. AFC’s? We are still waiting.
The resolution to our current debacle is for the board to back the Manager as he deserves and not to continue upsetting his calculations with its dithering in the transfer window and targets that he had for it. If AFC finishes below 4th position in the EPL 2011/12 we should hold the board and the ‘silent one’ accountable NOT AW.
AW is too decent a fellow to snitch on his employers and would rather take the blame for everything than have project youth derailed beyond recognition. There are cynics on that board who have seen this and seem all too prepared to create disaffection and ill-will towards AW by the fans. “Only the fans can sack Arsene Wenger…”. Since when did the fans become board members and shareholders? But there would be a perfect alibi if the hue and outcry were loud and enough to justify his dismissal. We would then be told “…that was what the fans wanted” mission accomplished.
Where does that leave project youth? Where does that leave beautiful Arsenal play? Where does it leave the self-sustainable model of financing? Where would AFC end up?
before the game we all knew it that with the players available we had no chance at OT, wenger knew it and all true fans knew it, what i don’t understand is why we didn’t park the bus? i bet if we did the score would have been lower than 8!!! Wenger didn’t have plan B and that was a real problem. and why bendner was not even on the bench? his experience could have helped a bit yesterday and thats come from someone who rates bendner very very low!!!!!
Another thing we should notice is how we did not take the “damage limitations option” and change Arsh-Walcott for Miquel-Lansbury. Had we done this, we could’ve kept the score at 3-1, easy. But that’s not the Arsenal way. We DECIDED TO KEEP ON ATTACKING, by throwing in Chamberlain for Coquelin. And I love this decision to keep on fighting and attacking. We continued to get quality chances until the end.
We didn’t park the bus because at 60 minutes it was only 3-1 and Wenger decided to chase the match by taking off Coquelin and putting on Chamberlain in his place.
@037 – you’re right at least Wenger took an all or nothing approach as opposed to a defeatist attitude. He probably should have taken off someone else instead of Coquelin.
bobome,
I think your hypothesis/analysis of the Board/AW schism is excellent. It may well go along with what jas777 has been saying (that is, implying) about Silent Stan as someone who invests in teams (which my research indicates, start out pretty high in the standings) and then SEEMS to do very little to ensure their success at the very top. It does seem that Arsene was either ambushed or overruled at board meeting on the Members week; and that his public statements about not selling Cesc or Nasri for anything but fair value were turned into embarrassing contradictions by the subsequent crap deals with the self-interested help of Dein the Lesser in Cesc’s case, and the self-interested help of the former convict/French agent (with scores to settle against Arsene/Primorac) in Nasri’s case. It’s seems like a take the money now. Arsene’s role is unclear. But as long as he can’t go public without walking away from the job, then he’s in a bind, taking all the heat and being savaged by the media vultures like Guardian’s Richard Williams, Paul Wilson, and David Hytner – and they are after his head – while Silent Stan and others draw down the profits which information they are not obliged (yet) to share with the fanbase. This chaos, in my view, has a possible purpose, which is to massively destabilize the team and make it ripe for either a sale to a zillionaire other than Silent Stan, or a complete takeover by Silent Stan, or to continue as a side in chaos that offers cosmetic changes – perhaps even sacking AW due to “popular demand” or his perceived “instability” – that will keep fans spending on a future that never gets measurably better, whilst they play us like washboards. I surely – and openly – do not know. But this last part is only a feeble but earnest attempt to draw some further hypothetical conclusions from your most interesting analysis. I’d welcome your further thoughts, to try to shed more light than the current heat. Again, thanks to Sahil for this link which has overlaps with your analysis: http://www.thefootballnetwork.net/main/s378/st170548.htm
there’s definitely something fishy going on behind the scene during the whole summer, for the worst to happen, the management (that’s including the Board, Arsene ) has to be held accountable. Supporters are an integral part of the success of AFC or any club. Now is the time for someone to come forward to explain or enlighten us on the present and future plan for Arsenal. An open statement from the Board is needed ASAP !! And no empty words please.
If we make the assumption that Arsene and the board are reading from different hymnsheets, and that the football network article is a fair analysis of the situation at the emirates, then it appears that Arsene himself is on the side of the critics whilst also being on the side of those that declare theei undying trust of the man.
This slightly paradoxical situation actually puts all of us on the same side of the argument. Even if we support Wenger or do not, most of us agree that money and wages need to be made available, and if Arsene is of the same mind as most of us, then we’re all in it together.
This is a situation that is far more preferable to the polarised situation that up till now we feel we are all caught up in.
I detest the idea of arguing with any other gooner. If we can all line up on the same side, like yesterdays away fans, the troublesome journey we face can be faced together. Lets find a common enemy and concentrate on them. It’s fairly clear that this season is going to be more tricky than those we have faced in the last five or six years.
I respect the board for their great financial judgement throughout the last 10 years or so, their refusal to take dividends and their financing of the new training ground and stadium are great big plus marks.
Now though, I feel that the whole financial landscape has changed and the premier league is a different kettle of fish compared to ten years ago. Chelsea had only just started with their financial doping and it took a considerable amount of time before the team gelled and they started winning regularly. Manu, although being the richest team in the league had the americans piling debt on them, and whilst we built our infrastructure and our team suffered, we still punched our weight and won some stuff. Now that chelsea have settled down and man city have learnt from chelseas mistakes and manu, despite their debt problems seem to have built another young capable team, The board and our new majority shareholder must realise that to stay in touch with these other teams, they have to adopt a different game plan.
The youth project is an admirable thing, and with players like Jack and Frimpong coming through it’s hard to say that it doesn’t work.
That said however, in my opinion, the board need to realise that hiding behind Wenger and keeping the purse strings tight is only ever going to succeed in mediocrity. I truly wish that it wasn’t so, and that the FA would insist on financial fair play, but we all know that the more money floating around in the premier league, the more they earn and they are not likely to kill the golden goose.
We have spent the last few years trying to buck this system. In some ways we have succeeded because we have played the best football, we have always played in europe, but if the measure is silverware then we havent had much success in the last few years.
The cesc and nasri sales are arguably the result of lack of investment in the team, as is the difficulties we have in signing big names. I am not proposing we do a Portsmouth, but a one season test run of spending a big pile might go a long way towards succeeding in all of the above categories and may well appease some of the harder nosed fans whose only mantra is ‘buy buy buy’.
Ultimately if we can’t beat them we may have to join them.
Bob,
It is entirely plausible that working towards bringing in an even richer buyer of a weakened and under valued AFC may be in the offing. Never say never and you will not be caught unawares. Where does the money trail lead in AFC today? Follow the money and you will have a fair idea where the source of AW’s troubles are.
The arguments of the “Arsene Knows Brigade” are hilarious. If the reports are to be believed, Wenger has finally smelled the coffee and making furious bids for all and sundry including some Chelsea rejects. If this is true, then he is doing EXACTLY THE OPPOSITE of what the AKBs have been saying all along – that we should trust Wenger cos he knows exactly what he is doing.
I will wait until the midnight of 31st August to make any further statements, but if Wenger does end up making those fire-purchases, then I’ll be back on this board to ask the AKBs that if Wenger’s philosophy was correct, then how come he is being forced to sign players now? Would it mean that he got it wrong, and it took the debacle at Old Trafford for him to finally accept his mistake? That indeed his penny-pinching way was wrong, and he should’ve acted a lot earlier before he lost the fan’s faith and the team’s confidence and also some quality players? So be ready with the answers AKBs!
I liked the history repeats part of the article but cannot agree with the excuses like 3 of first choice back 4 were out. Look at their team- a new keeper who is roasted by the press for mistakes, 2 CBs out, main RB injured. Its not that they were defensively brilliant n all; but they looked like wanting to play.
It is a very lame excuse to say manutd had much brilliant team than us and very hurtfull also. We were playing our best attack, 2 mids who can start even if all are fit (either if not both). Same as theirs. And other were the same youngsters who I am sure will become the very future of our club in coming years. They have the talent, quality needed. Today just the intent was missing. can be because of unexpected entry on such a big stage. OT can be hard for newcomers. But we have to accept that Wenger missed a mark somewhere with the timing of the transfers (both in and out) and some tactics.
Hopefully Mertesacker will create a good solid partnership with TV5. You need to have 4 playable CBs in squad. That lack of depth has showed in last 2 weeks. But let’s start afresh. We will get our main players back after a good rest and have comparatively easy game. Lets slot a half of dozen of our own.