By Billy the Dog McGraw
Celebrations of Herbert Chapman day yesterday went on way into the early hours so we are very late with the Chelsea v Arsenal article, but here it is finally.
The allotment at Enfield is under 16 feet of snow, and Dennis B is sitting in the potting shed looking glum, pondering his pint of Ponder Rosa Pink. But I still managed to get a word or two.
Chelsea’s origins in 1905 are well known. A coal tip for the railways was turned into an athletics track, but the idea then came up that it could be a football ground. So work started and it was named Stamford Bridge with the notion that a non-existent team could be invented to play there.
The name “Chelsea” was chosen, and they applied for a place in the Southern League Division 2. Tottenham Hotspur objected to another club in London (even though it was Fulham who would be threatened by the arrival of a new club in a new stadium) and the Southern League dutifully did Tottenham’s bidding and rejected the non-existent (as in no players, no fans, and only a half-built ground).
Chelsea then, noting that Woolwich Arsenal were in the Football League, applied for a spot there, and got in, interestingly with Woolwich Arsenal voting and speaking in favour of the new club.
So Chelsea was formed and elected to the league thanks to the forward thinking vision of one club and the backward looks of another.
So to today. We might expect to see
Szczesny;
Sagna, Koscielny, Vermaeln, Gibbs;
Diaby, Cazorla
Wilshere
Oxlade-Chamberlain, Walcott, Podolski
Arteta and Rosicky still have calf problems, Gervinho is in Africa, and Fabianski is ready to start full training on Monday. The ref is Martin Atkinson.
As for the other team, Terry could start, Cole might fire an air rifle, Rafael Benitez wants to manage Real Madrid, John Obi Mikel and Victor Moses are in Africa.
We looked at Chelsea’s home record yesterday, noting how home fans turning against a team can make life very difficult. Since Roberto Di Matteo went, Chelsea have won once at home. As for past results at Stamford B. they are 25 wins for us 25 wins for them and 25 draws. But our current form shows WWWW in the last four games.
Sitting and getting cold we could have any of these:
Mannone, Martínez, Giroud, Jenkinson, Yennaris, Mert, Gnabry, Squillaci, André Santos, Arshavin, Ramsey, Coquelin,
I thought Coquelin did very well mid-week, so we could well see him come on at some stage.
And that’s about that I guess. With the road out of my village just about impassable, I’m stuck at home with Sky. Good luck to those who actually have made it to the ground.
- Signing Theo on the eve of Herbert Chapman day
- How Arsenal supporters can learn a lot from Chelsea fans
- Theo signs. So what of Edinson Cavani?
- Theo and the transfer market dilemma
- Vorm was in vorm, but we’ve got Jack. Reflections on Swansea
——————————–
The books…
- Woolwich Arsenal: The club that changed football – Arsenal’s early years
- Making the Arsenal – how the modern Arsenal was born in 1910
- The Crowd at Woolwich Arsenal FC: crowd behaviour at the early matches
The sites…
- Referee Decisions - just what are the refs up to this season?
- Parent News - what is going on in schools these days?
- The weight loss programme: The only guaranteed way to stay fit
- The Arsenal History Blog from the AISA Arsenal History Society
MIke T, if you are still with us
So when a player cuts the ball back isn’t he supposed to follow the ball in order to have a chance to score?
So when Ramirez played the ball away from goal wasn’t he supposed to also run away from goal?
Mind you I’m not even suggesting that Ramirez dived. I will have another look of course but I really think that because of him cutting the ball back, he slipped on the slippery surface and then when in the air made sure he would make contact with the keeper.
And just having looked back at it: Ramirez positioned his body to run away from the goal.
Our win rate is 41%. I’m not sure how the squad is good enough with that statistic. If I were working for a company getting 7 million a year I think they’d have every right to sack me.
Our bizarre manager comes out with conflicting statements every week. One minute we are looking to strengthen, the next the squad is good enough, which I think most of us agree that it isn’t, the results prove that, and then we might strengthen in one or two areas, then we have two or three players for every position and we are not close to signing anyone.
If we did intend to sign someone I’m sure we must have had targets before the window opened, so maybe we had none, which really beggars belief because who in their right mind believes this team is going to win the CL, never mind any lesser trophy?
I wouldn’t mind the transfer inaction if we had no money but Gazidis says we have 35 million to spend so what the bloody hell are we doing?
Field day for the AAA to come out and play ( but they don’t exists, of cause ?)and make hay – you need a lot of hay to produce bullshit ! Happy crapping !
Me ? I have a condition called Selective Hearing( reading) , so if I don’t respond to you (and your taunts ),its because my medical condition filters out bullshit and insane comments !
Yes Brickfields they are enjoying it when we lose.
After all, they are the real “supporters”.
My contribution to the English language is this new word: suphaters. That is what they are.
Arsenal fans aren’t enjoying it at all. If you think they are then your deluded. If Wenger buys nobody in this window I think he’s lost his way. If he thinks this team is going to deliver anything except further frustration then he’s even more deluded than some on here. We need a DM and a striker seeing as we only have one and he barely functions.
Oh and did you notice Manu had what looked like a certain penalty not given? Seems they get decisions against them too.
@Brickfields, what are these insane comments my good man? Are you referring to my statistic about our win rate? It’s pretty insane isn’t it and yet we have a good squad.
All the best Bricky, your comments still make me chuckle.
Don’t forget Rupert, all those openly claiming they want us to lose. Deluded as they are in thinking it will bring change to Arsenal. Change of manager, change of buying players.
If you hope that we lose in order to bring change, that is what I call being deluded.
But when we lose they sure look happy to come out and pat themselves on the back. That looks like enjoyment to me
Morning Walter
I am not sure that Ramiers meant to play the ball the way it went but I take your point
Interesting you say about slipping because having watched match of the day thats the way it looked to me more than a foul.
I know that you all feel “cheated” but dare I suggest that many of you Gooners are retreating into an almost everyone is against us mentality when, you need to be more open to where your team is.
I try not to wind people up on here but I guess being a Chelsea supporter I always will but I thought we would at best get a draw yesterday but even when you scored I didnt see an Arsenal team that had the cutting edge, the desire or indeed quality save two or three of your players the only area where you have players that would be challenging for a place at the very top table are Carzola and Wiltshire.
The greater of your problems are your back four. Yesterday every time your two full backs became advanced you were wide open on the flanks. In truth we werent able to expose that weakness much in the secons half because of the way your midfield pressed but even then there were a couple of occasions where we were able to pull your two central defenders wide and they were exposed for pace.
We arent playing well at the moment , I accept that, but the crazy thing is had we beaten Southampton and QPR at home, which we should have,we would be just one point off second.
Hey as they say time to move on. For us its Swansea which will be interesting but I see that you have West Ham midweek they will cause you all sorts of problems but one thing is for certain you cant afford to drop any points.
Hey onwards and upwards!
Au contraire Rupert !I don’t ‘engage ‘ nor put down most people or their comments ,unless I either see a funny angle to it or it’s so stupid that I take a sideswipe at it .I’ve occassionally have hit it out of the park or at the very least sixes !
I , like most am not happy but choose to support the Arsenal
nonetheless without asigning blame to all and sundry .For now I’ll exit with this quote .
“I don’t know the key to success, but the key to failure is trying to please everbody.” Bill Cosby .
@Walter, no the glee is in proving everyone on here wrong. Mostly directed at the rude comments certain people direct at those who dare to question Wenger. And because despite evidence to the contrary there are still some who think this squad is good. I actually don’t think it’s a bad squad, probably capable of snatching fourth but that isn’t really the point. The fact is that we’ve sunk so low, expectations have been decimated and we can’t even get a few decent players in when we needed them at the beginning of January.
It doesn’t help when Wenger says we’ve been looking everywhere for replacements that are better than what we’ve got and you look at Giroud, Ramsey, Gervinho, Santos and to a certain extent Sagna based on recent form and you wonder what the hell he’s talking about. And then he comes out with his desire to build the team around Diaby. I mean is the man obsessed with him. I think Diaby is a good player but can you seriously rely on him to see out a season? It worked with RVP but he doesn’t play in such an injury prone position.
And after that first half performance you really could find more effort from the likes of Bradford. With the exception of Wilshire the team appears to lack pride, passion and guts far too frequently.
Too many people are in denial. Wenger has certainly earned himself some time with his previous great achievements but if we don’t secure fourth considering the money we have stashed away then someone should be accountable. Personally I’d like to see Gazidis gone but he doesn’t pick the players.
We should win the next three games if this squad is as good as Wenger believes. If we don’t then fourth maybe a bridge too far. Then will we spend all that money we have put aside or will we have to sell Wilshire because after all that’s what a self-sustaining model is all about? Oh and by the way if we continue along that path, selling the RVPs and replacing them with inferior players we’ll be winning nothing for years. You don’t build a stable team following the crazy model we’ve adopted.
@Rupert and guys and gals ,
When you see my avatar and before you read my posts ,just think of this ‘ Dastardly ‘ but lovable cartoon character who probably personifies me the most .What about you ?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SKm5xQyD2vE
@Brickfields, mine represents all the knock outs I deliver to my detractors on here. I sometimes feel ashamed because it’s so easy to defeat those who argue with me. It helps of course that Arsenal are so calamitous.
I used to love Wacky Races. Probably still would if it was on tv now.
I haven’t seen the match yet. Just saw some of the highlights yesterday, and I’ve read the comments. From what I can gather, we had a shocking first half, added to by the ref’s poor decisions. Sadly, both those factors are not unexpected. We do tend to start games too slowly, and the refs…well..
I can understand people being disappointed. Both at the result, and at least half of the performance. What I don’t understand is why every fucking result which doesn’t go our way, leads to cries of outrage, and how we’re mediocre, and how we’re doomed if Wenger stays, or if Usmanov doesn’t come in..blah blah fuckin blah.. It’s annoying, and this is not what football is supposed to be like.
I agree that we need to spend, but let’s say we don’t. I’d still wish we can finish top 4, so we get more funds into the club, and then I can hope we can spend in the transfer market again. Why will it ever change? Because there is going to be more money coming in. The TV deals (which won’t give us an edge over English sides, but will in Europe) and our new commercial deals (which will give us an edge over other PL clubs) But those commercial deals don’t start till 2014, although some money has been brought forward to next summer. And the new TV deals likewise, next summer. Can we afford to wait til then to buy, especially if our primary targets are only available then? Tough call. I’m inclined to say no, but either way, I’ll be backing the club to finish in the top 4. We’re good enough to do that, though we’ll need some luck along the way too.
Rupert,
When did Gazidis say 35m? Maybe I missed it, but quantifying how much money we have to spend would be a huge change of club policy. My guess is that you pulled that figure out of thin air.
Also, gleefully jumping on one example of ManU not getting a decision their way, is the sort of behaviour exhibited by ManU’s idiot fans. Like they claimed ATkinson lost them the match against Chelsea, when they benefited equally from some crap refereeing (including a handball goal) What happened after that? Atkinson didnt get a ManU game for 11 months. Likewise with Clattenburg after the 6-1 drubbing by ManCity. Following which he handed ManU the match against Chelsea when he got to do a game for them again.
No..ManU don’t get ref favours at all. That’s just what jealous fans of other teams say. Rupert, if all fans are so tribal that they just feel that way, then why don’t you? Are you not a fan? Or do all fans not feel that way without cause?
You know what makes me laugh the most? A lot of gunners when diaby was injured kept talking up the guy like his absence was the cause of our demise, using the liverpool match as evidence. It always made me laugh, diaby has had extended runs of playing time at arsenal and frankly he’s had more bad games than good. The matches against man utd wen he scored an own goal, the 4-4 against newcastle, the 0-1 loss to chelsea in 2007 spring to mind. What is worse is when I hear we want to play him in the viera role, I chuckle. Diaby is one of the most indisciplined players I’ve seen. I’ve never seen a player who’s tried to dribble inside the 18yard box when his team is under pressure, as many times as diaby, and he failed to make a succesful dribble most of those times, yet will do it again and again. I pray he’s fit and plays, so he won’t be used as an excuse for the poverty of the squad. If rooney is injured man utd can attribute poor form to his absence, but certainly not so if it were anderson
Fascinating insight into your thought process rupert cook, with your post at 9.54.. Not only do you assume your victory(which makes the assumption that this is a contest), you enjoy putting other people down more than Arsenal winning. And now you’ll argue you didn’t say that, but yes, you did. I can also say something without saying it. I can say I don’t think you are a depressive sewer rat, and that I totally disagree with bjtgooner when he says that. I’m done feeding the troll. Spreading lies, half truths, and revelling in spreading negativity, behind a veneer of civility. I can deal with the first bits because that is what trolls do. But the last bit is what is so annoying about you. You are hypocritical. Always being insulting (either of people’s intelligence, or their views), always complaining about people insulting you, and always claiming you are being respectful simply because you select your words very carefully. I too am selecting my words very carefully here when I say, FUCK RIGHT OFF. You deserve no debate. At best, you deserve ridicule.
uk
Diaby actually had a good game against Newcastle. It was when we lost him that we started to struggle. Diaby has had more than a few poor games. You are right about that. But he does offer us something very valuable. He is very good at holding the ball (sometimes he does it for too long), and he’s good at driving us forward. Can he be disciplined in when to sit and when to break forward? I think he can, and can be a very important player for us..IF..and that’s the big IF..he can stay fit. If he plays a number of games in a row, he’ll become more consistent, and poor games should get lesser in number.
Just thought I’d share something that happened on way to dropping my 5yr old to school this morning. He’s an Arsenal fan(taken him to watch a few games, & his favorite player is Theo). So he goes, ‘dad I don’t know what we can do about these referees, they don’t like Arsenal. Everytime a Chelsea player fell down they gave Chelsea a penalty, but when an Arsenal player fell over they just gave a free kick. They did that again last week against Manchester.’
I tried to quote what he said here. Now, I have not told him what I think about the refs, and think I only had a little rant when Kos was sent off(I didn’t even watch yesterday’s game with him). Something might have influenced him to think that, not sure what, but I was just gobsmacked he came up with that. Didn’t know what to say. I didn’t think a 5year old had the capacity to think there could be favoritism in sport. Maybe my little rant played a part? Its disturbing if he’s going to grow up thinking there’s no fairness at all in sport. These refs should realize they’re role models to millions of kids out there, and they shouldn’t be seen to be ‘cheating’ or rewarding cheats.
@Shard – well said mate!
@Rupert – somewhere you have also mentioned ‘savage breast’ – go find some and come back only once you have found one!!! You filthy swine…sick of your moronic jibes.
Shard two things
1) What made diaby’s performance against newcastle bad was the needless sending off. If it hurt the team that badly, I think we can agree that it was a bad day for him.
2)I believe when you say holding the ball too long, u mean holding onto the the ball to the point of eventually losing it and putting the team under pressure, or to the point where it kills a potentially good attacking move. Fabregas and pirlo are good at holding onto the ball for long periods(even longer than diaby) but we all celebrate them, why? Because they hardly lose it to the opposition and they usually use the time to conjure something good attacking-wise.
So in all I think u and I agree on those points that diaby had a bad day at newcastle and negatively holds on to the ball too long. I do agree wit u dat diaby has had great games where his ability to make those drives was a joy to watch eg liverpool/porstmouth 2009/3rd goal vs aston villa 08/09 and even for france @2010 wc wher I thought he was the best french player. But the point is, 1) if diaby has had an impact for arsenal, its been in fits and spurts, so its funny to hear people say, if diaby was around we wouldn’t have been in this dump. And I repeat, diaby, to me, has had more poor games than good.
2) The times diaby has had positive impact for us hav been when he played a more attacking role. So depending on diaby, with his indiscipline and tendency to “hold d ball too long” in the dm role is quite frankly laughable. You can say, he could make the transition and be a sucess, many have done it, kolo toure started as a striker, joseph yobo did, but are more renowned as defenders. But that is an “if” the answer being in the future in diaby’s case. So it won’t be out of place to hear an arsenal fan say “I hope diaby can become our viera”. But its funny when they attribute arsenal’s form now,to diaby
And please leave rupert alone, he’s done nothing to you, how he thinks or not shouldn’t be your concern, all that bile just because of a little comment?
@al
Please don’t take this wrongly mate, but I seriously doubt you’re telling the truth about what happened wit your kid
Al:
Perhaps Walter’s the boys real father ?
Do the Untold Cult think Georgie Graham is now an AAA or like many 000′s stating the truth ?
http://www.talksport.co.uk/sports-news/football/premier-league/130121/exclusive-george-graham-claims-arsene-wenger-must-take-blame-arsenals-sl-1897
No George Graham is another person who doesn’t live in today’s reality.
The answer is in the article you link to, Doublegooner. Just look for it and find it.
Its the truth, why would I lie about that? He has above average intelligence too, and asks some very difficult questions, which aren’t relevant to this discussion, but that may explain part of why he asked me that this morning.
@Shard, Gazidis said we have 35 million available for Wenger to spend. I’m rather disappointed in you that you’d think I’d make some figure up.
I’m not tribal. I’ve grown out of that. I try to be as objective as possible. It really isn’t my fault that Arsenal are so haphazard, though judging by some of the opprobrium I receive you’d think it was.
I pointed out that Manu non penalty incident yesterday because I was met with a hail of abuse when I suggested that Manu get harsh decisions too. Going by the logic of many on here, most of it embarrassingly flawed, if Manu had got the penalty they’d have won. Nonsense of course because the game was far from over but that random logic is applied when similar happens to Arsenal.
@Asif, why be angry with me? I’m not the one letting you down frequently.
@al, well if your kid has above average intelligence he’ll soon be a member of the mythical AAA. Only joking so don’t get all in a tizz.
As to the refs being cheats I think you need to go and report them or something as you obviously have incontrovertible evidence. Or it could be that they’re just not very good.
Doublegooner
You will be hearing from my missus about that:)
Ok, enough about my boy, I think Diaby is quite good. When Wilshere came back from his long lay off he didn’t just start by running the midfield, it takes a while to get over the rustiness. Rosicky was like that too. As a plplayer who’s been out injured more often than when fit, he’s had more hurdles to overcome than the other two, just hope he stays fit till end of season.
@Shard, I just read your rather odd outburst. It’s a blog mate, calm down. It’s a joke, a little bit of harmless repartee. I may disagree with you but you make very pertinent arguments on the whole and the comment was certainly not aimed at you anyway.
uk
Diaby’s sending off was needless but was brought on by Barton’s assault on him. I don’t know if you’ve seen it, but Diaby’s leg bends quite unbelievbly there and was close to breaking point I would argue. His reaction, while stupid in the context of the game, was justified. Especially considering the injury hell he’s been through. You can’t say you want players with fire in their belly and not accept those sort of reactions as collateral. The real villain that day was Dowd, and if he had provided protection to the players, Diaby wouldn’t have had to take matters into his own hand.
Secondly, I thought I said that the reason Diaby’s impact has been in fit and starts is because he’s only ever been able to play in fits and starts. Given more game time, he should be more decisive. I think he can make the transition because though he was rusty against Swansea, he did show better discipline, and a definite improvement over the City game.
However, I agree with your overall point that Diaby’s absence shouldn’t be any sort of excuse for our form. Yes, we need a Diaby type of player and he would definitely help us. But as of now, Diaby not being fit is to be expected, and we should have a replacement for him in the squad.
If how rupert thinks is of no concern to me, why is it of any concern to you what I say to him?
@ Walter: we should have scored but did not. They did. be it a poor decision or not. We were not in the game for the 1st 45 mins and if you are focused, you will let in goals / defence make silly challanges, etc. If we played with the same intensity as the 2nd half, we could have won the game.
As for what my manager told me [we had a few funny ref]. “dont give them the chance”. when i became a senior player, I would tell my team . “you score 2, 3, 4, the ref cannot do anything. he may give 1 or 2 decisions against.”
rupert
A link showing where and when Gazidis said 35m is available would make your stand more believable. I am not saying we won’t have access to 35m, or even more if required. I’m just saying it hasn’t been Arsenal’s policy to disclose transfer budgets. So, Gazidis saying what you say he said, would be a reversal of policy. For which I’d like some proof.
Gouresh,
those were the days that there still were fair refs
Gouresh,
but what if those 2 decisions cost you 2 goals… then it gets a bit more complicated of course.
uk,
now, don’t take this wrong mate, but were you mistreated as a youth? how dare you turn on a man who cites his kid and asks for advice? do you think in your massive cynicism that people will resort to trawling their children, or any children, in order to win a football debate? If you do, you have an unhealed wound and shouldn’t air it in public by assailing a man who cites children as an object lesson. And hey, mate, don’t worry, this is only a football blog. Be happy.
rupert and Shard,
I don’t think rupert can come up with that link and support his claim to 35M. i’d be happy to find that out of the horse’s (oh sorry, Mr. Gazidis’s) mouth.
That said, I’d agree with what I think is your drift, Shard, that there might indeed be more than 35M, but we don’t know anything for sure, by design. I’d have to say that, from what’s available – including club voices saying there is money to spend and no problem, all of which statements are well known at this point – then we can each/all reach a guesstimate based on known and expectable revenues: TV deals this summer of 2013 I think, but correct me if it’s 2014; CL qualifier from last season; real estate deal consummated; zero transfer balance achieved; big money made on sales of cesc, nasri, song, rvp; ticket sales; merchandise; strategic partnerships starting with the Emirates deal. Of course there’s overhead including the stadium payout which is not eternal. Now, what mostly worries me is that with 4th place by no means secure (or near to secure?), that this insecure position will itself be used as an excuse to justify an alleged “need” NOT to spend, so that we can save for a rainy day. However, IF this because an excuse or rationalization not to spend in this transfer window, then I hope that people will remember all Gazidis and PHW’s blather about there being a Plan B, so no worries if we do not make the CL this (any given) season. I remember this and will not accept our precarious position as a reason not to spend now; but must join the many who say and feel in their hearts that this precarious position means spend now and save the season. If we do not, then we will be sailing toward a Liverpudlian fate. If that’s the case, the Emirates contract will fall to its lower end and help cement that fate. In that case, if the current ownership hasn’t already decided to sell off and be gone, then scenarios like trawling the likes of Jack to shore up the ship will, imo, be massively tempting to them. In which case we will lose half the fan base out of sheer disgust and take years to recover from an epic collapse. Now I say all this because, even if my logic is faulty, I think it is time to grasp the depth of this moment and to advocate as strongly as possible for major expenditures on major pieces and take those risks; because the risks of not spending are even greater (if any of this nightmare of mine unfolds).
p.s. sorry, meant “IF this becomes an excuse…”
Does anyone have hard figures on what the TV deal amounts to? what it will mean to AFC? Does every team have an equal share in that deal, or is there a sliding scale or range? Is this deal a secret? Are there no trade/industry analyses of its magnitude and breakdown? There’s got to be in the business press. And if anyone can find it, knowing any of this, or at least a sound guesstimate, would help put our analyses and debates about what’s affordable and splashable on much firmer ground for us all. Perhaps someone of all readers has a link or two to provide toward such an analysis. It would provide at least one ray of light in the darkness that surrounds each club’s finances; even as football (like cricket in India) is, in fact, a very public pastime (even as it is privately trawled like chum to the fish).
bob
Sorry. When I said next summer in regards to the tv deal, I meant summer 2013.
You might find this link helpful.
http://www.sportingintelligence.com/2012/06/19/premier-league-tv-rights-qa-including-where-the-money-goes-and-what-next-190601/
@ Walter: It would not matter, as I would make sure that we scored 4
Shard,
Many thanks for the link. It looks jam-packed with lots of data and breakdowns of the outlays by finishing position. I’ll get to reading it within a couple of days. Hopefully it will shed some light and we can discuss further. Cheers
always blaming wenger, diaby ramsey the defence, why cant you blame the refs to just for.once.
@ rupert
it doesnt need a smart mind to realize that refs are always biased against us
it doesnt need smart mind to realize that the team is not motivated due to negative supporters and media
it doesnt need smart mind to realize that a fan should first do his job by supporting from min. 1 to 90 and then he can blame players for not producing…
its a shame that we have a stadium called a library, and that we boo our players, destroy them and them.blame wenger for makjng arshavin what he is, oh come on be a fan for once, and by this i mean all arsenal fans, be biased towards ur team for once,…
George Graham is an AAA member, why else did he go to Spurs
:-D