Comments on: The world cup final: being bald does not make you into a good ref

By: you must be joking

you must be joking — Tue, 10 Aug 2010 23:18:24 +0000

@KM — well, it WAS a rubbish world cup final.

By: KM

KM — Thu, 15 Jul 2010 08:33:16 +0000

i think overall Webb was quite good. there were so many fouls in this game from both sides – with the Dutch the most cynical and the Spanish the most theatrical IMO If De Jong was sent off for that challenge on Alonso it would have dramatically changed the outcome of the match and made it a rubbish world cup final…so in a way its a good thing he wasn’t sent off

By: A Casual Observer

A Casual Observer — Tue, 13 Jul 2010 11:50:06 +0000

Why did FIFA pick Webb?

Well – I would assume that this was a political decision from FIFA linking back to the Triesman ‘affair’. If you remember your history he in a ‘secretly taped’ conversation that he knew absolutely nothing about; he ‘outed’ Spanish collusion with Russia to use their contacts in the Russian Mafia to bribe the Referee’s to give them World Cup glory in exchange for Spain pulling out of the 2018 World Cup bid and backing Russia (this is all documented) – and when you think about it a skint English FA with a Wembley shaped white elephant really, really need the 2018 World Cup in order to sell some £10 burgers and/or fish and chips… so Triesman’s comments would send a message out there from the FA that ‘We know what you are doing’. Then he resigned, with a wry smirk on his coupon, and said “sorry about that”.

Now FIFA/Blatter and co all love a bit of cash and I reckon that England 2018 is the place to make it… what with all the infrastructure and stadia already in place and global fan base in country – FIFA could, I imagine, strike quite a deal. The one problem though… bungs and favours aside; the process is inconveniently democratic.

So wadda you do eh – you have one country about to buy votes for corruption and probably get away with it? Wadda you do?

What would Blatter do?!

Well – I’m assuming that Webb was put forward by the Riley, PGMOB and FA as a man they can trust i.e. not answering his phone to any Russian gangsters for a few weeks… so… give Webb Switzerland Vs Spain – just to show them what he can do and then put the power in his hands in the final to make or break Spanish World Cup dreams.

This is now fertile ground for a ‘deal’, shall we say, to be struck the other way AND with the added bonus of dusting off suspicion of the England bid getting boned by Spanish/Russian corruption complicity.

Webb only needed to put a blanket on the game (many small whistles), hold back the better team (Spain), give everything offside, remove advantage play, give nothing in or around the area and NOT send anyone off – keep it 0-0 and wait for the call from Spain.

Everyone’s a winner… that is except for Russia.

By: Bart

Bart — Tue, 13 Jul 2010 08:27:12 +0000

“One of the most boring, repeating sagas of personal prejudice”

Oh the irony.

By: Rhys Jaggar

Rhys Jaggar — Tue, 13 Jul 2010 07:40:28 +0000

‘Finally the world cup is over. Time to start looking ahead and think about real football, club football and Arsenal.’

Finally your opinions about this are at an end. One of the most boring, repeating sagas of personal prejudice.

By: goonergerry

goonergerry — Tue, 13 Jul 2010 02:22:12 +0000

I thought Webb was a surprising choice for the final. How easy is it for a ref brought up on kick and rush northern English football- best described as “violent but fair” to distinguish between play acting and real fouls? Both sides play acted but the Dutch did try to physically stop Spain from playing- they in turn tried to gain advantage by diving every time they were tackled.
Webb performed like he always does-issuing too many cards- so the yellow card is issued for slightly mistimed tackles- like the one Van Persie was booked for early on with no intent as well as for much more serious dangerous tackles- like Van Bommel’s on Alonso- it clearly has little impact. It is no surprise that people are calling for sending offs- but do people really want to ruin the spectacle by sending off 2 or 3 players? The answer is to issue fewer yellow cards not more.

By: Adam

Adam — Tue, 13 Jul 2010 00:18:00 +0000

Shotta gunna, I feel the advantage rule leads to a feeling of unfair play. But do very much understand the need for a flowing feel to the game. Some teams do break up play as a tactic, we as arsenal fans should know only to well, My point which i should have made clearer is persistent infringements are a bookable and sending off offence but a ref must either stop play or deal with the situation at the next break in play, after that its too late he cannot show a card for the offence, so this can lead to a sense of inbalance to the game, which for me, is not on. Id rather stop play to deal with an infringment to show the players that this cannot continue. over the 90 mins if you have to book then send off numerous players then so be it, clubs will soon get fed up of paying suspended players wages.

By: Bart

Bart — Mon, 12 Jul 2010 19:13:02 +0000

Thanks Walter, we’ll see if something surfaces in the next few days. I remain to be convinced, but this is not the thread to discuss this.

By: A2Gooner

A2Gooner — Mon, 12 Jul 2010 18:57:22 +0000

Marcus: The pomp and circumstance you mention made me realize how Howard Webb officiates a match, like a traffic cop. His overly exaggerated hand gestures and mannerisms remind me of a cop who is tasked with directing traffic at a busy intersection. He is a cop (as it was mentioned ad nauseum throughout each match he reffed).

Walter: I agree that RVP did not get adequate service. Robben should have passed to an open RVP for a clear shot at least once in the final. Sneijder made no attempt to ever involve RVP in this or any other game. His only hope was Van der Vaart, who saw too little time in the whole tournament because Van Marwijk had to play two defensive midfielders since neither have the pace to adequately cover the space on the pitch. This strategy, combined with the extreme physical tactics the Dutch deployed in the final, made certain that RVP was never going to have an opportunity to make his mark on the tournament.

By: Marcus

Marcus — Mon, 12 Jul 2010 18:48:51 +0000

However, the most artistic merit I saw in this game was Iniesta Versus Robben in the world freefall swooning competition..

ok, they were fouled, but some of the writhing was ridiculous.

Call me partisan, but the game only livened up when Cesc added some real spark to it

By: Marcus

Marcus — Mon, 12 Jul 2010 18:46:44 +0000

won even

By: Marcus

Marcus — Mon, 12 Jul 2010 18:45:48 +0000

A sin-bin, which most 21st Century sports seem to have, would not go amiss in football…..

In fact how about some C21 technology…oh, I think thats been covered already.

I think if Webb had imposed the rules of the Game correctly, he would be applauded. THAT IS HIS JOB !!!

If Blatter wants a good spectacle, he should tell the managers that, and maybe introduce a second Trophy, the Artistic Merit Cup.

That would be great, because Holland 74, 78 would have one that.

By: walter

walter — Mon, 12 Jul 2010 18:05:21 +0000

Bart, not exactly in the press about this, yet.
But I did have the feeling that RVP was playing on an island a bit. He didn’t get the supportive runs he normally gets when he plays for Arsenal from other forwards or midfielders. The Dutch team played the ball most on the flanks for Robben who only can run at people but hardly gives a pass ot another player. And Kuyt who works hard but on the left flank is not the best player ever to have played there.

I don’t know if it was deliberate to not playing the ball to RVP. Robben is a very selfish player by nature and when it works this is fine but when not you lose a player in fact.

I think we will maybe hear more about this in a few days. If RVP wants to speak about it.

By: Bart

Bart — Mon, 12 Jul 2010 17:26:56 +0000

@Walter; sorry to ask an off topic question but something has been really bugging me: there is a very persistent story in the British press and blogs that the Dutch, especially Sneijder and Robben, were refusing to pass to v Persie. I didn’t see it like that at all, I thought he did a great job for the team, working his socks, creating chances for others and, sadly, only scoring once himself. I’ve been googling the Dutch press about this (I live in the UK) but couldn’t find anything about him being ignored. Anything in the Belgian press about this?

By: Chris66

Chris66 — Mon, 12 Jul 2010 17:06:08 +0000

My point is that Van Bommell and the Biscuit have kicked and cheated their way through the entire tournament and Iniesta, Xavi and certain other Spanish have dived like tarts and waved cards in every single game. The time to take care of this was well before the final, not in the showpiece by which time it is too late. Whatever Webb did he was going to be in the wrong.

Surely that is the consistency we are looking for?

By: walter

walter — Mon, 12 Jul 2010 16:55:01 +0000

In fact when I have a game of two teams at the top in their division I call the captains and the team representative in my dressing room before the game. And then I tell them what they can expect from me. No asking for cards, no kicking the ball after the whistle, no dangerous tackles. I tell them that to me it is no problem to send someone off the field and that is up to them to make it a football match or a fighting game. And I tell them to tell this to their players before the games starts and that is their responsability to alert them.

And then on the field I give them one warning (the first player that kicks the ball away or asks a yellow card) and this loud en clear with enough gestures so that everyone can see it. And from then on I do what I have promised them.

I think in yesterdays game it even could have been done by the 4th official or even been done by Fifa itself.

By: walter

walter — Mon, 12 Jul 2010 16:47:29 +0000

I have to disagree on those who think that if Webb would have done it to the rule book we would end with 7 against 8 on the pitch.
In fact according to Blatter one of the reasons why football is so succesfull is that it is the same game played from the youth to the world cup final with the same rules everywhere.
Now we are talking of professional football players and if they feel that the ref will send them off, they will no longer take the risk. And if they do? Then they just have to go.
I think one early sending off could have changed the game completely and would have made it in to a football match. Maybe the Dutch team would have gone with all in defense but the kicking would have stopped. I’m sure of that. And if they don’t stop I would ask Fifa to check their blood or urine to see what they have taken before the game.

If professional players feel the ref will not hesitate to send you off, then you can be sure they will behave. No footballer wants to be known for their sending off in the final and make their country lose the game.

If Fifa would have told the two teams in a briefing the day before the final that the whole world will be watching and that every dangerous tackle will be punished with a red card and that players asking for cards for opponents would get themselves a yellow card, the two teams would have known before the game what was comming.

It can be as simple as that but, what do I know about clean football if you compare it with Platini or Blatter…

By: Davi

Davi — Mon, 12 Jul 2010 16:33:30 +0000

@Chris66 – If it ended up as 7 against 8, then it would have been the fault of the players. You would hope that having seen the ref wasn’t going to accept bad challenges, after one player got sent off, it would have calmed down, but if it doesnt then the players have only themselves to blame.
Besides, these refs should be concentrating on making correct decisions. If something is worth a yellow or red, then give it. This “common sense” refereeing is so ridiculous. Because webb didnt want to send someone off, it descended into a game of just kicking and diving. The other problem wiht this “common sense” is that it varies so much from referee to referee. No one knows when they go onto the pitch what they can and can’t do, because its just so inconsistent. Why cant these guys just apply the laws of the game?

By: Chris66

Chris66 — Mon, 12 Jul 2010 16:13:52 +0000

Webb refereed the game like it was a Premiership game -which perhaps isn’t that much of a surprise. He allowed a lot of physicality (too much) and tried to keep 22 players on the park and try and not ruin the game. In so doing he ended up allowing the game to be ruined as it became spiteful, petty and ugly.

However, we have to give the guy a bit of a break.

Van Bommell should have been sent off in nearly every game of the tournament and Spain have been diving and waving imaginary yellow cards for the whole month. If Webb had done as some on here wanted it would have been 7 against 8 and everyone would have slated him for imposing himself too much on the game. Until the coaches and players take some responsibility the ref, whoever it is, is on a hiding to nothing. You can’t right all the wrongs that have been building in the game for years (feigning injury, violent tackles, cheating, etc.) in one game, no matter how high profile it is.

As regards the hypocritical comments by the english media pundits, come on! Surely this would only be worthy of comment if they aren’t hypocritical. Is a bear catholic? Does the Pope sh*t in the woods?

By: shotta-gunna

shotta-gunna — Mon, 12 Jul 2010 15:56:27 +0000

No Adam. We don’t need refs stopping play for every infringement. We need refs who blow at the right time for the right reasons. Players are like kids in a school yard. If you are not firm and consistent you have chaos. Coward Webb consistently inconsistent, unless the club is Man Utd. If he had set the tone from early by despatching Von Bommel we may have had a spectacle. Instead he dished out 12 yellow cards and you could see him cringing and calculating when to deal a second until Heitinga gave him no choice. Judging by his performance we can expect no better refereeing next season.